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Veteran Smacker
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Right now, I look like the owl in Yelena's signature, so excuse me if I make less than complete sense. Yelena, it's not so much that things that I don't understand bother me, but one of these days, I'd like to understand EVERYTHING, or at least come to some peace of mind because I understand me. Either everything or just me. I'm an uncompromising individual. Shadow, remind me, what's the LHC? And I'm not surprised that people are looking for Hawking's theoretical dark matter. It could be what sends us into a new era of technology, rather than destroy us all Bible-style. If we can find a way to efficiently travel off-planet, we could save humanity, 'cause after all, it's us that needs saving, not the planet. The planet is fine. It's been around for hundreds of billions of years. How long have we been around? Maybe a few thousand, tops? And we've only been engaged in heavy industry for the past two hundred years, and somehow we have the arrogance to think that a few plastic bags and aluminum cans are going to make a dent? Why don't you ask those people in Hawaii who built their houses next to an active volcano (and are wondering why there's lava in the living room) if they feel like a threat to the planet. The planet is fine. It's not going anywhere. WE ARE! We're going away. Pack your sh*t, folks. We're slowly destroying ourselves in a passive, nihilistic manner, and will soon be phased out. The planet will shake us off like a bad case of fleas; a surface nuisance.
"You can never escape me... Nothing harms me. But I know pain. I know pain. Sometimes I share it with someone like you..."
To answer any and all questions about my personal self or actions: because I can.
Previous post count of 2,103 posts.
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| Posts: 2952 | Location: Either hitting the books or the punching bag | Registered: April 05, 2006 | |
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Smacker-in-Training
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The LHC is the Large Hadron Collider, It's a particle accelerator. It smashes ions together to see what happens. Science in one of it's purest forms if you ask me. Deep space travel isn't going to be here anytime soon. As far as we know the lightspeed speed limit is still in full force for any object with mass, no matter how small. As for the planet, it's 4.5 billion years old, the universe is 13.7 billion years old. Hominids have been around for circa 3 million years and the oldest homosapien is 60.000 years old. To put things in perspective  Unless ofc, if you talk with a creationist they will give you very different numbers ><
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Our species needs, and deserves, a citizenry with minds wide awake and a basic understanding of how the world works. [Carl Sagan, The Demon-Haunted World]
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| Posts: 330 | Location: Earth Orbit | Registered: April 05, 2006 | |
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Old-School Smacker
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quote: Originally posted by Drake:
Yelena, it's not so much that things that I don't understand bother me, but one of these days, I'd like to understand EVERYTHING, or at least come to some peace of mind because I understand me. Either everything or just me. I'm an uncompromising individual.
I suggest you start with yourself. Seriously, you will have better luck understanding that. And once you understand, the rest will fall in place. I mean understanding on a metaphysical level; an opposite to seeing/feeling/measuring/sorting everything. quote:
If we can find a way to efficiently travel off-planet, we could save humanity, 'cause after all, it's us that needs saving, not the planet.
Other planets don't need a herd of littering-like-crazy, love-to-play-God 2-legged mammals for anything. quote:
The planet is fine. It's been around for hundreds of billions of years. How long have we been around? Maybe a few thousand, tops? And we've only been engaged in heavy industry for the past two hundred years, and somehow we have the arrogance to think that a few plastic bags and aluminum cans are going to make a dent?
If that plastic bag was idly sitting somewhere there, it wouldn't be a problem at all. But it doesn't. A whole stack of other garbage isn't just sitting an a dump either. They all ooze toxins. The planet doesn't have to explode to become inhospitable to all but the most primitive and aggressive species (I don't mean humans); and moving somewhere off it is like moving to a next house because this one is trashed beyond repair. BTW, non-human inhabitants of this planet that you believe is fine started to feel our presence way before the last 200. quote:
Why don't you ask those people in Hawaii who built their houses next to an active volcano (and are wondering why there's lava in the living room) if they feel like a threat to the planet.
They probably don't care. Like aborigines of Australia don't particularly care about axing out groves of trees before plowing another field. Not because they are evil, but because they lived like this for thousands of years and it's a sacred ancestor-endorsed way of life. quote:
The planet is fine. It's not going anywhere. WE ARE! We're going away. Pack your sh*t, folks. We're slowly destroying ourselves in a passive, nihilistic manner, and will soon be phased out. The planet will shake us off like a bad case of fleas; a surface nuisance.
What will be left of it, to be exact. No one in their right mind is preaching that we are a threat to the Earth's very existence. What we are turning it into it and to ourselves is another story. We are not something separate from our environment that can just pack and leave at will and expect for the planet to clean up our mess. ~~~~~~~ CoffeeOwl  I know that you believe you understand what you think I said, but I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant. ~ Author unknown ~ |
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| Posts: 4828 | Location: Outskirts of Silicon Valley, California | Registered: April 05, 2006 | |
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Veteran Smacker
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quote: Originally posted by CoffeeOwl:
No one in their right mind is preaching that we are a threat to the Earth's very existence.
I know. I was getting less serious and more satirical with that post you quoted most of during the end there. Silliness is in my nature.
"You can never escape me... Nothing harms me. But I know pain. I know pain. Sometimes I share it with someone like you..."
To answer any and all questions about my personal self or actions: because I can.
Previous post count of 2,103 posts.
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| Posts: 2952 | Location: Either hitting the books or the punching bag | Registered: April 05, 2006 | |
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Old-School Smacker
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Silliness is good. Something I completely lack. ~~~~~~~ CoffeeOwl I know that you believe you understand what you think I said, but I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant. ~ Author unknown ~ |
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| Posts: 4828 | Location: Outskirts of Silicon Valley, California | Registered: April 05, 2006 | |
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Smacker-in-Training
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quote: Originally posted by Drake:
Right now, I look like the owl in Yelena's signature, so excuse me if I make less than complete sense.
Yelena, it's not so much that things that I don't understand bother me, but one of these days, I'd like to understand EVERYTHING, or at least come to some peace of mind because I understand me. Either everything or just me. I'm an uncompromising individual.
Shadow, remind me, what's the LHC? And I'm not surprised that people are looking for Hawking's theoretical dark matter. It could be what sends us into a new era of technology, rather than destroy us all Bible-style. If we can find a way to efficiently travel off-planet, we could save humanity, 'cause after all, it's us that needs saving, not the planet. The planet is fine. It's been around for hundreds of billions of years. How long have we been around? Maybe a few thousand, tops? And we've only been engaged in heavy industry for the past two hundred years, and somehow we have the arrogance to think that a few plastic bags and aluminum cans are going to make a dent? Why don't you ask those people in Hawaii who built their houses next to an active volcano (and are wondering why there's lava in the living room) if they feel like a threat to the planet. The planet is fine. It's not going anywhere. WE ARE! We're going away. Pack your sh*t, folks. We're slowly destroying ourselves in a passive, nihilistic manner, and will soon be phased out. The planet will shake us off like a bad case of fleas; a surface nuisance.
Dude, I so feel your pain.......my thirst for knowledge is very time consuming, and fun. May I add to the discussion something though on the Big Bang theory, metaphysics, matter and the unknown: We all strive to know the all, yet that is impossible, for the brain has it's limitations. It's like colors, there may be a color we can't see because our eyes can't see. Like black holes, they wouldn't have been thought to have existed if it weren't for a math problem done by Einstein, and the mysterious dissappearance of stars in a region of darkness. Sometimes, you might want to sit back, and find a place to begin. I suggest based on your post, that you look into astrophysics, because that part of science actually is the borderline of our undertanding of the universe. And it also can at times be in the realm of the metaphysical, especially trying to figure out what powered things like the big bang. Or figuring out what is dark matter.
Life, love, liberty, freedom, justice and equality for all......
.........for all regardless of any other reason.
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| Posts: 231 | Location: new york state, united states | Registered: December 15, 2007 | |
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Veteran Smacker
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quote: Originally posted by sonofhorus:
We all strive to know the all, yet that is impossible, for the brain has it's limitations. It's like colors, there may be a color we can't see because our eyes can't see. Like black holes, they wouldn't have been thought to have existed if it weren't for a math problem done by Einstein, and the mysterious dissappearance of stars in a region of darkness.
The brain has limitations. It can only fire off neurons and cycle organic fluids so fast, like a computer's hardware. The mind, however, has no limits, as people have shown us throughout history.
"You can never escape me... Nothing harms me. But I know pain. I know pain. Sometimes I share it with someone like you..."
To answer any and all questions about my personal self or actions: because I can.
Previous post count of 2,103 posts.
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| Posts: 2952 | Location: Either hitting the books or the punching bag | Registered: April 05, 2006 | |
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Smacker-in-Training
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quote: Originally posted by Drake: quote: Originally posted by sonofhorus:
We all strive to know the all, yet that is impossible, for the brain has it's limitations. It's like colors, there may be a color we can't see because our eyes can't see. Like black holes, they wouldn't have been thought to have existed if it weren't for a math problem done by Einstein, and the mysterious dissappearance of stars in a region of darkness.
The brain has limitations. It can only fire off neurons and cycle organic fluids so fast, like a computer's hardware. The mind, however, has no limits, as people have shown us throughout history.
What makes you think the mind and brain are not the same thing? As far as modern Neuroscience is concerned, the mind/body dualism is in full retreat.
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Our species needs, and deserves, a citizenry with minds wide awake and a basic understanding of how the world works. [Carl Sagan, The Demon-Haunted World]
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| Posts: 330 | Location: Earth Orbit | Registered: April 05, 2006 | |
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Veteran Smacker
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quote: Originally posted by ShadowDragon:
What makes you think the mind and brain are not the same thing? As far as modern Neuroscience is concerned, the mind/body dualism is in full retreat.
Personal philosophy, as well as observations. Why do you think world records are broken? Besides intense training for one thing or another, the mind can be convinced to aid the body in acheiving the "impossible."
"You can never escape me... Nothing harms me. But I know pain. I know pain. Sometimes I share it with someone like you..."
To answer any and all questions about my personal self or actions: because I can.
Previous post count of 2,103 posts.
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| Posts: 2952 | Location: Either hitting the books or the punching bag | Registered: April 05, 2006 | |
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Smacker-in-Training
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quote: Originally posted by Drake: quote: Originally posted by ShadowDragon:
What makes you think the mind and brain are not the same thing? As far as modern Neuroscience is concerned, the mind/body dualism is in full retreat.
Personal philosophy, as well as observations. Why do you think world records are broken? Besides intense training for one thing or another, the mind can be convinced to aid the body in acheiving the "impossible."
I mean no disrespect drake but the particular example you mentioned is prone to many other factors, you're going to have to do better :P The brain and the mind are linked because the mind is a result of the brain. Therefore it's no surprise they influence each other. If you want to know just how much effect a certain mind setting can have on the body, the placebo effect is a prime example, yet there is nothing mystical at work there.
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Our species needs, and deserves, a citizenry with minds wide awake and a basic understanding of how the world works. [Carl Sagan, The Demon-Haunted World]
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| Posts: 330 | Location: Earth Orbit | Registered: April 05, 2006 | |
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Old-School Smacker
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quote: Originally posted by ShadowDragon:
If you want to know just how much effect a certain mind setting can have on the body, the placebo effect is a prime example, yet there is nothing mystical at work there.
And how does that confirm that the mind and the brain are one and the same? ~~~~~~~ CoffeeOwl I know that you believe you understand what you think I said, but I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant. ~ Author unknown ~ |
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| Posts: 4828 | Location: Outskirts of Silicon Valley, California | Registered: April 05, 2006 | |
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Veteran Smacker
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quote: Originally posted by ShadowDragon: quote: Originally posted by Drake: quote: Originally posted by ShadowDragon:
What makes you think the mind and brain are not the same thing? As far as modern Neuroscience is concerned, the mind/body dualism is in full retreat.
Personal philosophy, as well as observations. Why do you think world records are broken? Besides intense training for one thing or another, the mind can be convinced to aid the body in acheiving the "impossible."
I mean no disrespect drake but the particular example you mentioned is prone to many other factors, you're going to have to do better :P The brain and the mind are linked because the mind is a result of the brain. Therefore it's no surprise they influence each other. If you want to know just how much effect a certain mind setting can have on the body, the placebo effect is a prime example, yet there is nothing mystical at work there.
I am not saying that the mind is the equivalent to the soul. I believe in both the brain and the mind. We can measure what goes on in the brain. We can watch synapses fire and weigh the mass and volume of this particular organ. But the mind, consciousness itself, is an entirely other matter. Some people can't even begin to FATHOM how others think, and yet there are some people who are so in tune with the world around them that they can avoid mishaps others can't even start to understand HOW they did it. I'm not, so much, questioning your logic to try to prove that humans are "magical" (or however the hell you want to spell it), but rather I quantify the brain and the mind differently. Two very different people can still be measured the same and appear the same on machines that measure brain waves, but both could have very different "luck" in life. I've come to realize I'm believing less and less in that particular excuse to good lives.
"You can never escape me... Nothing harms me. But I know pain. I know pain. Sometimes I share it with someone like you..."
To answer any and all questions about my personal self or actions: because I can.
Previous post count of 2,103 posts.
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| Posts: 2952 | Location: Either hitting the books or the punching bag | Registered: April 05, 2006 | |
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Smacker-in-Training
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quote: Originally posted by CoffeeOwl: quote: Originally posted by ShadowDragon:
If you want to know just how much effect a certain mind setting can have on the body, the placebo effect is a prime example, yet there is nothing mystical at work there.
And how does that confirm that the mind and the brain are one and the same?
Because one doesn't need to invoke a new unobserved/unmeasurable matter/energy to explain it. If the mind is the result of a physical system it will have little trouble influencing that system. All it has to is influence itself. Now we know the brain isn't just one lump of grey mass. It has numerous parts responsible for numerous tasks. The brain is a big and complex organ, if it is not the seat of the mind and just moves our limbs and stuff we could've made do with something the size of a baseball. Occam's razor also comes into play. The problem of the non-physical interacting with the physical goes away if you can explain things using only the physical. Which modern neuroscience can do more and more. So far there is little to no scientific peer-reviewed evidence to support dualism. Though I believe we've had this discussion before didn't we coffee?
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Our species needs, and deserves, a citizenry with minds wide awake and a basic understanding of how the world works. [Carl Sagan, The Demon-Haunted World]
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| Posts: 330 | Location: Earth Orbit | Registered: April 05, 2006 | |
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Veteran Smacker
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quote: Originally posted by ShadowDragon:
Because one doesn't need to invoke a new unobserved/unmeasurable matter/energy to explain it.
Perhaps one isn't. If I wanted to refer to the brain, I would. But when I refer to consciousness, the origin of thought, basic awareness or the psyche, I refer to the mind. Two parts of what could be the same thing. I'm not saying either way, really, if duality is right or wrong. I'm simply making a distinction between the two. We can see the brain. Can we see a thought? Hear it? Feel it itch along the back of our skull? No, but there are some who would call themselves "mind-readers". Can't say I've met one who can back up the claim accurately.
"You can never escape me... Nothing harms me. But I know pain. I know pain. Sometimes I share it with someone like you..."
To answer any and all questions about my personal self or actions: because I can.
Previous post count of 2,103 posts.
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| Posts: 2952 | Location: Either hitting the books or the punching bag | Registered: April 05, 2006 | |
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